i work for myself and some contract clients are up for renewal this year. after working flat out for the last 3 years and still no closer to owning in even the most chavved out area, ive decided to give up working so hard. it gets me nothing but more useless lira and is stressing me out for nothing.

anyway, to cut a long story i raised my contract prices by 65% this year. my clients can take it or leave it. i dont see why i should work 50+ hours, make their systems efficient and then go home to a bedsit.

it isnt a temp situation with an end to it, so i have run out of steam. last few months/weeks i cant even be bothered picking up the phone anymore. i feel like its been a waste of time and effort, while unemployed chavs have better housing.

if you cant beat them - join them. i expect att least 1/2 of my clients to find another contractor. about 1/2 cant move yet as they are dependent on some systems they use of mine. they will have to pay the new rates for at least 1 year or so. ive decided to sock it to them. i feel like i have nothing to lose but bu11sh1t and merry go round work. im passing the housing costs upwards. if they think "oh, this is steep - its tripled". then thats how it is for my living costs and that cost has to be met from something - my new prices.

all i wanted was a small house with small garden. i have to jump through 6 hoops a day and still cant afford one. so im not playing the game. im taking at least a year off, maybe more.

i sent out a few new contracts last week at the new rate. no feedback as yet. i have a war chest in the bank i was going to use for a deposit. now i can save and live off it. i dont want competitive clients. just crazy triple priced ones to cover the loss of hours for the same net weekly income.

i was going to move to another country. wait for houses to lower etc. i now realise that this mess will take at least 5 years to correct and that i still dont want to leave UK. so im slowly opting out and having an easier life instead. resigned to the thought i would never own anyway. why get on this crazy roundabout when all i am doing is servicing others needs and recieving no REAL recompense for my trouble.

stick your monopoly pay. i dont need it. im already twiddling my thumbs a bit the last 2 weeks, but hey - i havent lost my house or place in the queue for it. im still renting the same flat, so cutting hours has not affected my life so far. im looking forward to summer as i plan on going to cornwall for upto a month at a time. instead of a week then stressing over customers and income and then speeding back to work.

i realised a while ago, that the sums didnt add up. this isnt a story. its true. my prices are now massive. clients, some are going to be upset, but my core life - wont change. ive given up hope and with it the need to earn and save for no reason. im a couple of weeks in and its gone quiet, but im happier for now. i thought about it a lot. it came to a head after christmas when i worked like a dog and still wasnt any closer to the end.

i can always revert the prices and gain more business if i need to, but for now. im taking some time out from the hopeless uk life race. i was wasting my time and living on false hope.

Good strategy - keep going upwards. Eventually, you may only have 5 clients but each pay you handsomely and realise you're good value because you will be there for them because it suits you both.

Good luck

I'm going through a similar situation at present (sort of).

I'm applying for permanent jobs (I'm a contractor at present), and I'm asking for quite a high salary, but one which I think is market rate for someone with my qualifications and experience.

But is does occur to me that in order to earn think kind of money, I'm going to have to work extremely hard, and very long hours (something I don't have to do at the moment). And I'm starting to ask myself. "Is it really worth it ? Only for 50% of the extra I earn to be taken as taxes and NI which won't actually benefit me directly at all !! "

How much better off would I actually be opting for the high flying City job compared to the quite well paid and far less stressful option I'm enjoying at present ?

i was always ok with the income tax. that was reasonable. if it were 2001 prices homes i would have a very satisfactory life. as it is. i get what chavs get for free, but have to work so hard for it. it makes no sense.

as financial planner said, cutting down on mid clients and leaving a hardcore of good clients will give me more time for them for the same rates or slightly less. and we will both beneifit from that in work quality.

i was taking everything on to try to grab big deposit and payment money - then i got to thinking WHY ?

I too am sat on what is piles and piles of money in terms of goods in the shops but is a drop in the ocean vis a vis the cost of houses..............and it's accumulating at the rate of £1200 a month.....but like you say it seems like Monopoly money....
because i don't like shopping but i do like houses..........Why should i give someone who bought 6 years ago a brand new Ferrari..as a recent analogy in here went.....?......and pay for it over 25 years.......?

See my thread about young execs needing big pay increases.


You are right and i have done effectively the same thing about a year ago, i put up my rates knowing i will lose half my work, which i did, i also sold my house i had good savings and now take it easy as a 40yr old who could not see the point of working in a demanding job (which to be fair was well paid and that i enjoyed but had very long hours and like you i had to keep jumping through hoops all day long) at some point you STOP playing the work game, it is easier todo if your a self employed freelance/contractor you have no staff job to give up but it seems mad these days to work when all you need todo is down shift and have a better quality of life.


Good luck.

I ran a business for a while - hardest bit was getting customers, next hardest was keeping customers, easiest was losing customers.

3 years isn't a too long a time to build a business - I'd think long and hard as to which customers you wanted (were able?) to keep and look after them 100%.

Work, as well as life, is all about priorities.

Lots of valid points here, I've run my own company for 15 years now, and still going strong, however over the last 3 years, my prices have risen by 65%, where old customers leave, new ones appear, I have less work, more money, less stress.

However this strategy can come undone in a severe downturn, but you can always price adjust to compensate.

I plan to work from home once I've bought again, scaling down further to core clients, who pay OTT, but get great service!

Tally Ho .....

loanshark - this is exact my plan. downshift - i like that. im going to quote that to friends etc.

ignorant steve.
i appreciate the points and agree, but the crux was. yes its tricky to get work, its tricky to keep it and easy to lose it. what does losing work mean to avergae joe ? = losing his house. i dont have one. i have nothing to lose but valuable time. there never was or would have been a house. i realised that recently. that was the straw that did it. i dont care if i lose them all. ill still be renting the very same flat as now. my cars paid for and i have no debt. i dont need this 'work' or this trafford centre lira. i can only have 1 wide screen tv at a time. i already dont shop as i dont know what else i can find to buy. a more expensive watch. fancy threads ? - tchhh. not worth it. i already feel like a chav. i only wanted a small garden. about 6m x 6m would have done. just a place with some grass to sit in on a sunny day that was mine. no reward - no workiee. - and i had china clients.!!!

Spooky. Mirrors my own situation exactly.

I jacked my rates up a year ago, and now find that I'm 'resting' 6 months of the year. But that's fine, as I get 6 months to do what *I* want, and in the other 6 months I can easily cover my bills plus add a bit more to my large 'pension' pile by earning good rates. Life has never been a sweeter balance for me than it is now. Still, I was lucky, I've freelanced for 16-17 years, so the pile is pretty robust.

Mind you, I'm still spending far too much time on HPC - and I'm working at present! Still, I've gotta do something whilst these blue IBM installer bars slowly crawl across another window on my desktop.

Nomadd

Don't give up the day job Edward! :-)

Seems that companies expect you have to sell your soul even on a moderately paid professional job these days so might as well either go the full hog and get paid heaps or cut back and spend time enjoying yourself.

merscl is right?

What if 100, 200 perfectly qualified people applied for a position - as is frequently the case - do you have any bargaining power over pay? If you're underemployed or unemployed, you'll take well below the market rate to get your foot in the door and be thankful.

If your upto your eyes in trying to meet your monthly debt repayments then you have to accept your lot on the treadmill, enjoy !

They may be perfectly qualified, however far fewer than that will be suitable candidates for a given position, i.e. experience, personality, etc. etc.

sheesh, if things were half as bad as you say don't you think graduate unemployment would be far higher???

this is the best thread ive ever seen.im the same self employed, cut my work to 6 months in a year.ive worked out just by making home brew im saving more than my money is earning in the bank, better life,less stress and hopefully doing my bit to save the world.
i have decided i couldent give a t*ss what happens to house prices any more less hours and quality of life is far more importent

Spot on.

Only solution is to leave the country and come back when it has sorted itself out (ie. put all chavs/single teenage parents/spongers, etc.. in prison)

right freds dead,

That was a heartfelt but well-argued post. It seems wrong that someone in your position should feel forced into making such a decision ... something in this society has to change.

Sometimes this country seems work-crazy - why do we do it? A huge proportion of all the labour we used to do is now automated, and yet the days of a one-breadwinner family are well and truly over. Even a working couple can barely afford children, these days.

Maybe it's true that our generation have higher materialistic expectations, but at the same time we all know that its our own consumerism that's helping to keep the country's economy afloat. Shopping is almost a patriotic duty these days.

Far better, if you can afford it, to enjoying living your one and only life, be a part of the community, and make a tacit but persuasive lifestyle vote for a better world.

Best of luck for the future and thanks for providing such an interesting post!

PD

This is really interesting. I'm changing my job, though remaining self-employed, and just started turning away lower paying high frequency jobs this week. It took some doing.

This thread is highly supportive of the idea. I also decided to only earn what I needed to and actually do more of what I like.

Surely, if lots of self employed make this decision it means, en masse, that we will all be getting better rates as it is reducing the pot of people available to work for the lower ones. Although there is plenty of room at the bottom, I wonder if the self-employed have some pricing power here.

No wonder Gordy plans to hit the self employed with restrictions on expenses. His IR35 legislation already made a lot of us decide to earn less. One way to screw him is simply to earn less. Way to go!

There are plenty of people up to their eyeballs in debt who will work for whatever they can get. If you're in IT and you have fashionable skills - good luck, you'll get decent rates for now. But change these days is happening faster and faster. Who knows what will be going on in 5 years time?
That's why it is so important to gain some security in life - and the best is a roof over your head you can call your own. If I were young now, you wouldn't see me for dust. This country is screwed.
One thing I find really sad (and there is an interesting thread about co-operatives on here at the moment) is the inability of young people to act collectively. When things were bad years ago people did something about it. A nice riot, or a strike. All the English young do is moan. If you don't like the world we've handed you, change it! Radical action is needed. But this dopey web site hasn't even got a FTB section and is not stirring young people to act.
If every young person in this country agreed not to buy a property for the next 12 months .... there will be a short, sharp crash. You have the internet, mobile phones, text messaging, MSN, email - yet you all walk round all day with ipods in your ears listening to drivel.
Its time for a revolution. Get on with it.

Maybe this thread has identified the "f*** it" factor where a tangible proportion of the population concede to not playing the game any more and catching up with the govt/BOE contrived inflation figures and balony housing low rate/debt/housing equity driven economy and throw in the towel, whilst at the other end of the spectrum there are probably many who have seen and continue to believe that their equity in housing will do all the work for them that they don't need to save/work. Is a big drop in productivity/output about to occur combined with a drop in consumption from curtailed debt-driven growth? The law of unintended consequences at work maybe, keep everybody a little hungry and striving for attanable improvements in lifestyle and it all hangs together, tilt the scales and make some fat whilst others starve and you have trouble.

Marina,

There are plenty of people up to their eyeballs in debt who will work for whatever they can get

If you have no assets you can default, you lose, but only the credit rating and the potential to work in a few occupational areas. All signs point to a rapidly increasing default rate.

The key to the world of work seems to be,

Self employed, debt free, contractor/ freelancer with low business overheads who can see that having time for yourself has value.

There is a saying
'All the good things in life are free'

A few years ago i made a list of the things i enjoyed doing and it was a shock that they are either all free or very low cost !

Try making a list see if you come to the same conclusion.

'If every young person in this country agreed not to buy a property for the next 12 months .... there will be a short, sharp crash. You have the internet, mobile phones, text messaging, MSN, email - yet you all walk round all day with ipods in your ears listening to drivel.
Its time for a revolution. Get on with it.'


Agree i am amazed the young ones are so passive collectively they let their generation down.

Are they on drugs or something that keep them from building a better society

An American Businessman is touring mexico. One day he comes across a beautiful, secluded beach and finds a fisherman in a small boat.
'What line of work are you in, bud?' says the businessman.
'I just catch fish. What I don't eat i sell'.
'Hey, let me tell you a secret - you are sitting on a goldmin here. You could take people out in your boat and charge them for fishing trips, then you could get a bigger boat, then two boats, and employ people to sail them. Make enough money and you could build a hotel on by the beach and you'll get customers by the busload'.
'Sounds like a hassle' says the Mexican.
'But, just think, build up a business like that and you could retire early!'

'And go fishing?' says the Mexican.

Interesting posts from all,

I am currently earning 17K p/a as a marketing manager. If I were unemployed, I would get around 15K p/a from the state as I have 2 (soon to become 3) children.

It really grates with me that I work long hours, put up with great pressure, and get to see little of my family all for 2k p/a!!!

It makes me wonder why this government is so obsessed with means testing. If things get much worse, I will be looking for a Phd Studentship. The pay has always put me off before (12k), but if I can get it topped up to the 15K minimum living amount I may as well do it.

I will be doing something I enjoy, get to see my family for a change, and still only be 2k a year worse off.

Government intervention, who needs it?

http://www.tiscali.co.uk/money/guardian/ne...entcapital.html

Great thread,

urgh, sometimes you need to think why we were put on this planet???

Stand back and rethink - is all this sh*te really worth it? Sometimes you say no to this that and the other because inevitably you wimper "gotto work tommorow".

Theres are good poem from www.theinterviewwithgod.com, with a good line quote:

“That they lose their health to make money...
and then lose their money to restore their health.”

Time being, I am living to work, not working to live. I will be saving, and being conservative. If a house comes my way, then it is a bonus.

Trev...you summed up my feelings. I, personally would hate the prospect of working as a city type bloke earning thousands one minute, losing it the next....what a complete waste of a human body...You can bet there is a status grabbing wife behind all this income obsessed, house ownership rubbish....sorry to upset all the feminists here ...but it's true....most women ARE nestbuilders....it is built into them......they are only interested in bragging to their friends how much their husbands earn...and how much their house is worth, sorry, has been valued at by an 18 year old EA. A mate of mine's girlfriend phoned him up after 4 years non communication....just so she can tell him about her house extension....Who gives a Fack?!!

women are like cats.

Great Thread

Saw a simpsons episode the other day. It was the episode where Mr Burns loses his nuclear plant (again) and teams up with Lisa Simpson and builds the lil Lisa Recycling plant. One character said something that stuck in my mind. Skinner took in a whole pile of recycling and got back a few cents for his trouble. Skinner bitched that it cost him more in fuel than he got for it. THe recylcling hippy guy said "sounds like your working for your car. Simplify Man".

Just like this thread. What are we working for? Where does all our money go?

I work two nights a week and I earn 1/4 less than when I was working 5 days a week. I'm better off as well seeing as I don't spend money on smoko anymore nor do I have to pay for transport to get to work 3 days (ok ok I am going to uni but that is fun.... in a couple of weeks I'm going out to drive ambulances REAL HARD for training and I don't have to pay a thing ). I eat well, have a roof over my head, surf HPC. All in all I work less but don't have less.

I recall when I was working full time that after I paid for fuel, food and rent I had $100 in my pocket. Take from that repairs to my car (it was an old V8 that needed serious work) and I was lucky to be able to get p1ssed on the weekend. What a joke.

During my holidays (the life of a student ) my old man asked me if I was going to get some extra work. I asked him what he did that day only to be hit by a barrage of complaints about workers contractors and the like. I then told him what I did that day..... got up late.... went to the shops..... got some exercise..... watched a bit of tv. Then I asked him his plans for the next day..... boy was he ticked off. But then he is a baby boomer. Busting his hump to buy some shiney toy to impress people he doesn't like. He is impressed by money. When the boomers start selling their "investment" property en-mass and the price plummets I just may take one off their hands. Suckers

Busting his hump to buy some shiney toy to impress people he doesn't like
[/quote]




Classic

No-one does. But...

I've been in IT for 25 years (16-17 years freelance) and it's *always* been that way. If you don't keep up, you're dead - especially as a Freelancer. I've always worked hard at keeping my skills up-to-date, and I'm very selective about the contracts I take, as I make sure they are always enhancing my overall skillset. Remember, your running a business, and you're only as good as what your *next* client will pay.

The great thing about taking longer breaks between contracts is that you get plenty of time to learn/practice new skills, do your own research, etc. And with the wealth (no pun intended) of information on the Internet these days, it's never been *easier* - I remember the old days when it was very tough to get info. It's easy to keep up-to-date, it just takes hard work and focus.

Just my take.

Nomadd

The government is obsessed with means testing because the cost of paying benefits to everyone is enormous, and they would have to increase taxes massively to pay for it.

But in the circumstances you describe, you should be able to get some Working Families Tax Credit.