My wifes an EA in a south west chain of EA's, owned by countrywide, last day before christmas they were told that one of the neg's has to go, sales have been poor for a while now.

All other EA's in the town reporting the same, you would think that most sane people would be able to read something into this anecdotal evidence, not your average EA though, in fact no EA I have talked to.

Arguments such as affordability and the unserstainable price levels of property seem to wash right over them, I love my wife but have accepted that EA's must have been brainwashed during training/indoctrination, her argument is that people have been saying there would be a crash two years ago, and there hasent, this means that it will not happen... what!!!

It would not be too much of a problem, agree to differ etc, however she wants to move ASAP and will not accept that prices are likely to plummet, if it does not happen this year my argument will become less plausible, to her at least.

I think most EA's would welcome a sharp downturn in prices, its all about volume, they judge their offices pipeline against their competitors, if prices reduce it will all be relative, volume of sales means they have a job, albeit the office is less profitable. At the moment the average EA office is doing jack sh.t.

Is anyone else married to an EA Alien that will not accept the truth.

No, but the results the same, the good lady just will not accept that prices will fall!

I think they just can't envisage buying a currently listed 300K house for 225K.

I need prices to fall this year or thing's will get difficult trying to delay much longer!

Same with the missus. She ain't convinced.

In the same respect though if prices don't drop I will take my business abroad. I'm not going to finance rip off britain (PLC) any more.

A lecturer I had at college who was French moved here because he could see that the French with all their straw burning, union loving, short working hours and plenty of holiday attitudes would come a cropper, after living here for a while he became disalusioned and couldent understand how they have manged to get away with it for so long. Perhaps its the same for the UK housing market, just when you think it will start to become sensible it carries on and on and on until you just get fed up with the whole farce, and move abroad.

My wife's just bored hearing me talking about house prices!

Sorry to hear that Wurzel, that's a tough one...!
Has she been an EA for very long? Was she working at the time of the last crash?

Agree that this time must actually be the worst for EAs at the moment - ie when there is absolutely no market activity whatsover (that period if hiatus at the top).

Have you suggested that a change of location / office would be a good idea? If everybody else in the same office shares this opinion it suggests to me a lack of experience which does not bode well for the next few years.

This is sound logic. People have been predicting the demise of Fidel Castro for many years now, but he's still alive.

I confidently predict therefore that he will live forever, just like the Pope, who the doom mongers have also predicted to be not long for this earth, and the Queen Mother of course.

What?

She's dead? When did this happen?

Same here, so thank god for HPC so I don't have to bore her anymore. Not only can HPC save you from financial ruin, it can save your marriage as well!!

My wife is firmly converted and my advice on convincing any sceptics is to show them some long-term graphs - they never fail to shock.

She's been an EA for five years, we bought a flat in 1990 and made a 1k loss a year later, then bought a house which was still worth the same five years later, so yes she has experienced a crash, which is why I cannot understand her or her colleagues logic.

Unfortunately, and this is only my opinion, most people that work in EA's are pretty ignorant as to market forces and business in general, other than that relating directly to property practice law and house selling.

I have advised her to look for another line of business, as you can imagine this went down well

My wife asks if I still think there'll be a crash every day, but she's broadly in agreement.

We either see a house price crash or we leave the UK. It's that simple. There's no point slogging away for few returns.

Same here- bottom line is that if there isn't a HP crash over next couple of years then the UK economy will become hopelessly distorted and result in a huge recession- it would then be time to emigrate with the nest egg built up from renting at 60% of cost of a mortgage

Bear married to a bear. We're both Americans, and chose to live here :0

Have you got any handy?

As Americans.....surely, you must think the UK is really out of control?

I live in Hong Kong and I couldn't afford to move back to the UK at todays current prices, not that wild horses could drag me back there of course.

I would love to hear an American view point about life in the UK in general........I mean you could be living in Hawaii for Gods sake.......why the UK?

Cheers.

I work for an american company, one of the sales guys said to me on the phone "the united kingdom, thats England, Scotland and France and shit, right", he was serious

Its not just the country to consider, I've been to the USA many times and speak to many US colleagues every day, theyre good for a laugh, but I dont think i could live there for an extended period.

Good on you JP.




Hooray! A woman with sense!



I agree 100%. Ditto for me.




Good question!

Yeah. I'd go for Hawaii.

Good point.

I've decided that I'll give the HPs another year or two to crash (won't take that long IMHO), then I'm off to warmer climes

I'm not too comfortable with paying for Blair and his age groups pensions!

Yes; crazy bad out of control. I'm still mildly jealous of my sister, who lives in a small town in the midwest and recently bought a gorgeous, huge house for the equivalent of about £50,000. (The dollar's in the toilet; blink and that number will change.)

There was a recent Alain de Botton travel documentary on C4 which touched on why I'm here: he made the point that people seek out places which help to make them feel complete them in some way. There is a great deal I enjoy about GB which isn't negated by its less desirable attributes.

Pluses:
- the natives are slightly less insane than Americans, who proved what wimps they are after 9/11 ("Take my Constitution, please - I'm not using it")
- a lot of great scenery in a relatively small area, which is nice because I'm a photographer
- socialised medicine rather than pay-or-die
- more enlightened attitude to time off and other aspects of working life
- news programs aren't quite as gagworthy as those in the US
- far less religiosity. Politicians don't feel the need to say "God bless the UK"
- I get to see what it feels like to be a despised minority

Minuses:
- I guess we all know what the minuses are. Tony Blair, for a start, who in his own way is almost as bad as Dubya... To bring this back on topic, although I have no problem renting, as my name implies, it's still annoying to be confronted on a daily basis with 'housing ladder' brainwashing. Americans like to buy, too, but they aren't consumed by it.

Been here almost 10 years now and can't really imagine going back. Couldn't afford a house in Hawaii any more than I can in the SE, though granted the surroundings are rather nice.

My partner and I broke up last year because... all her friends were buying 4x4s and going on expensive holidays due to remortgaging or were taking out ENORMOUS mortgages on properties.... but, as I earned more than them, it was logical that we should be doing the same but more so...

Men and women are different. Yes, no doubt many women see thath ouse prices are way over-priced but many also seem to have the 'car colour' issue when it comes to houses...

Yeah, logical if you're a woman. Well done for kicking her into touch TMT.

This is so true! I know people who wouldn't earn much more than half of us that spend a hell of a lot more money than us...not theirs of course. I couldn't sleep at night having the credit card balances that they have. The crazy thing is that they don't care one bit about having almost £30k on their cards!!!

STR -- can you post some of these graphs on here, lease? I would love to see some -- I too believe this to be true -- By any chance do you have the graph which shows real Houseprices since the 1950s'60's -- showing how the ratio of wages to hprices has climbed enormously....

Ok,

First off is a chart culled from one of Roger Bootle editorials in the Telegraph last year. Shows HP/Earnings ratio back to 70s and also the long term trend in gross rental yields.

Second is a chart I made using the Nationwide average UK house data adjusted for inflation - in other words the trend in real prices and the only sensible way to look at the creation/destruction of wealth.

It shows the cumulative % growth in each up & down cycle. I defined the start of each cycle as the point where year-on-year growth first changes direction. That way it avoids the situation where there is a little dip but the market resums its overall trend. What is interesting about this I think, is that once one of these YoY trigger points is reached the market is then set for a long run in the opposite direction.

Can't post any more charts I've reached my global limit........

Thanks v much STR[etc] -- this graph should be printed and stuck to every students and young employed's wall.... That would really make them see the light.... Oh I SO wish people just UNDERSTOOD!!!!....

Same chart but overlays the year-on-year change in the BoE base rate. Illustrates the point that all previous down cycles continued despite significant rate cuts.

Finally, a more conventional way to look at the same data series. The inflation adjusted Nationwide Uk house price, with a simple trend line through it. The pink line is my not very serious forecast - made purely on the basis that it fits the pattern. Shows prices regaining their June 2004 peak in December 2025. Puts me in Bruno country....

It's like that story, the "boy who cried Wolf"... or at least the Estate Agents version....


There once was a shepherd boy who was bored as he sat on the hillside watching the village sheep. To amuse himself he took a great breath and sang out, "Wolf! Wolf! The Wolf is chasing the sheep!"

The villagers came running up the hill to help the boy drive the wolf away. But when they arrived at the top of the hill, they found no wolf.

"Don't cry 'wolf', shepherd boy," said the villagers, "when there's no wolf!" They went grumbling back down the hill.

Later, the boy sang out again, "Wolf! Wolf! The wolf is chasing the sheep!" To his naughty delight, he watched the villagers run up the hill to help him drive the wolf away.

But again there was no Wolf to be seen.

So the villagers took this as conclusive and indisputable proof that Wolves do not exist, and lived happily ever after.


...I believe that's how the story goes.....

" her argument is that people have been saying there would be a crash two years ago, and there hasent, this means that it will not happen.."

THAT IS the "weasel under the coffee table" argument.

The idea is... once you have lived with something for a long time,
you become so accustomed to it, that you cannot see it anymore.

Most big bubbles burst well after they become weasels

"Bear married to a bear. We're both Americans, and chose to live here :0 "

Same as you, I am an American-born Bear living in London.

Your reasons for being here are much the same as mine.
But I am thinking that I will move back to the US at some stage. But I cannot live there now as the madness has become so pervasive that I would feel like a "Man from Mars" every day I lived there.

America needs to face up to how spoiled it has become. Most Americans (like many Brits) are living beyond their means, borrowing money, and paying less taxes than they should, because the American government is able to get the money it needs by printing it, and exporting it to foreigners.

With $38 Trillion in Debt, the US cannot go on without printing more and more money, and eventually the currency will lose its value. The process once it starts will be quick.

See how fast money lost its value in Weimar Germany: http://www.Weimar.co.uk

When the crisis hits in the USA, the dollar may lose 50%-60%-or even more of its value, as rates rise (belatedly). Rising rates will eventually DESTROY US property values, and when that happens, that may be the time to step back in to the market. I cannot see it happening sooner than 2-3 years from now.

So hanging out in the UK as a "happy renter" is probably a sensible thing to do.

PropertyFacts.co.uk - Current House Price Trends


very good 50 year chart here.take a look

Running a woman can be more expensive than running a Bentley with a hole in the petrol tank...

"Running a woman is more expensive than running a Bentley with a hole in the petrol tank"

RIGHT.
Best defense: get to know the lady's character before you take her on.
If she thinks like that, run a mile. Eventually, if you are lucky, you will
find one with good values that you can live with happily. (I have!)

Many (even most?) women in this country are far too spoiled to even think
about marrying them. Why are MEN so afraid of commitment? Because of the
lack of fairness in the divorce law. It is a one-sided contract, that needs
some deep understanding before you commit to it.

I know some young couples (cohabiting) who have bought houses together when prices were low, and have split up not long after. The women got to keep the house and pay cheap mortgages while the blokes were out and lost out..... How can they rebuild at current prices?Losers.

if i do get married it might have to be to a ladette

if it was a girlie girlie then i don t think i could afford to be keeping up with her friends purchases all the time and those gold credit cards to help pay off...

Whoose that Wayne Rooneys girlfriend - Colleen whoose from a normal working background- always in the papers spending ££££ thusands... argghhh! It would be cheaper to go to a brothel everynight than to service Colleen... Say goodbye to you hard earned cash and house.

Rooney is young, and so is his gf.
They both think the easy money he makes will go on forever.
Their characters will get tested when they find it does not,
or worse yet, if the big sums he is getting prove insufficient for their
growing appetites

It could happn sooner than you think: "The Dow Jones Industrial Average shed 98.65 points, or 0.92%, to 10,630.78, while the S&P 500 fell 14.03 points, or 1.17%, to 1188.05, its worst decline since Aug. 5. Selling intensified in all three major indices after the Federal Open Market Committee released minutes from its Dec. 14 meeting showing growing concern about speculation in asset markets.

Some FOMC members voiced concern that low rates "might be contributing to signs of potentially excessive risk-taking in financial markets, evidenced by quite narrow credit spreads, a pickup in initial public offerings, an upturn in mergers and acquisition activity AND ANECDOTAL REPORTS THAT SPECULATIVE DEMANDS WERE BECOMING APPARENT IN THE MARKETS FOR SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES AND CONDOMINIUMS," the minutes read.

"No one likes to see inflation put into print next to the Fed's name," said Art Hogan, chief market analyst with Jefferies. ""

http://www.thestreet.com/_yahoo/markets/ma...=FREE&cm_ite=NA

If it has taken them this long to suss it out they must be very dense, or liars.

I was going to say it's become a foreign country to me, but you're probably closer to the mark. It's a whole 'nother planet.

I used to be amazed how many men I know in their 40s and 50s were marrying girls fromSouth America. I assumed it was because they were all stunners and looked and acted incredibly femmine compared to the fat British female blob.... This is only half the reason... the main reason is that more and more UK men simply do not trust British women...

Not difficult.




This can be a solution, but the problem is is that if you make a life in the UK with your svelte foreign bride, the same divorce laws apply; so a foreign bride is no guarantee of not being taken to the cleaners. Not getting married is the only solution, and even then if you live with someone I believe they have a claim on your property. It seems there is absolutely no way to protect yourself in the event of a break-up in this country (pre-nuptial agreements are totally meaningless under UK law).

What happened to female class in the UK? I went on a mission for several months came back, went out for a drink and was shocked with the number of profanities and expletives from several girls mouths. F'ing this f'ing that, bellies hanging out. Terrible demise of the UK. Americas bitch and a crap one at that.

Simple answer to this....Marry a foreign girl from the east (Thailand, Fillipean) but DO NOT live in England. She can come for holidays on visitors visas only. Rented property in these countries is unbelievable cheap by UK standards and the weather is so much nicer. Keep all your cash in off shore or Uk investments and if the marriage goes pear shaped she can't claim a penny.

Down side is you will be spending long periods apart but you can't have everything.

Another downside to this arrangement is that "while the cat's away the mice will play". She's almost certainly got 3 or 4 men on the go on this scenario and you have no way of knowing.

Agreed!

But I have a even better method:

Marry a Japanese wife, but live in Asia! (I live in Hong Kong with a Japanese wife.......bliss!).

Asian women are just lovely!

This makes me sad

Are there no British females on this forum?????????? C'mon stand up for yourself

Prove me wrong that you are not spoilt, untrustworthy, expensive commitments....

Otherwise you'll going to find yourself alone and with yor credit card and shopping for company - all the men are marrying asians!

Hey, hey, hey.....calm down. Not all us British women “want it all”. Myself and my husband have lived in a flat (a large victorian style) for fifteen years, happily plodding along having a good life without huge bills etc. I gave up my full-time career and worked part time so I could look after us both well (he works hard at work so deserves to be well looked after). Anyway, out of the blue came along a baby girl which we never thought would happen. She's two years old and it's sometimes difficult living in a flat with a two year old child (luckily we have a bit of a garden) but I cannot tell you how blissfully happy we all are to be a family which appreciates what life is really about. People around us seem to be unhappy in the fact that we live in a flat with a small child and say “you should move”. I say “not yet, we'll wait for prices to drop, get something better for our money”.

I look at people around me who live by designer labels, posessions and money and think “how sad you are.” We've got something so precious money can't buy it.....happiness and a daughter who lights up our every day. I could cry with joy whilst others cry for the latest fad they don't yet have.

If you men out there are decent, good men then I believe you'll eventually meet the same kind of woman....but beware the spoilt girlie girl, I certainly would if I was a man!

My wife's just bored.

Good for you, a child is wonderful!

My wife really wants a baby now......it would certainly put a new angle on life and I would be delighted too.

You are quite correct though, too much consumption these days, and nobody is any happier!

Good to hear some people remain sensible in the UK.

Cheers.

As is my husband. It is now a banned topic

Good thing you can come on here then isn't it BB?